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phil_t
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Wulfharth goes Walkabout
      #1656281 - 07/29/03 10:33 PM

'Wulfharth goes Walkabout'

This is my attempt to explain how the mortal Wulfharth became the Underking of lore and learned to persist beyond his lifespan.

I begin with the logical text ‘The Five Songs of King Wulfharth’

Quote:

“The first song of King Wulfharth is ancient, circa 1E500. After the defeat of the Alessian army at Glenumbria Moors, where King Hoag Merkiller was slain, Wulfharth of Atmora was elected by the Pact of Chieftains. His thu'um was so powerful that he could not verbally swear into the office, and scribes were used to draw up his oaths.”




The thu’um is a powerful Nordic voice magic, this explanation comes from the World of Tamriel lexicon at the UESP -

Quote:

“Through the use of the Voice the power of a Nord can be formed into a thu'um or shout which have a large variety of applications (anything from sharpening blades or as a long range weapon). Master Voices (known simply as Tongues) have legendary, and often unbelievable powers. Their powers have been known to include talking to people over hundreds of miles and teleportation. The most powerful masters must even be careful whenever they speak as their voice can cause great destruction, and are commonly gagged.”




Wulfharth clearly had a very strong thu’um if he was not allowed to speak normally anymore. His power was so great that it even began to worry the gods, so they plotted his destruction. Again to ‘Five Songs of King Wulfharth’:

Quote:

“Orkey, an enemy god, had always tried to ruin the Nords, even in Atmora where he stole their years away. Seeing the strength of King Wulfharth, Orkey summoned the ghost of Alduin Time-Eater again.”




From ‘Varieties of Faith in the Empire’:

Quote:

“Alduin's sobriquet, 'the world eater', comes from myths that depict him as the horrible, ravaging firestorm that destroyed the last world to begin this one. Nords therefore see the god of time as both creator and harbinger of the apocalypse.”




Back to ‘Five Songs of King Wulfharth’ again:

Quote:

“Nearly every Nord was eaten down to six years old. Boy Wulfharth pleaded to Shor, the dead Chieftain of the Gods, to help his people. Shor's own ghost then fought the Time-Eater on the spirit plane, as he did at the beginning of time, and he won, and Orkey's folk, the Orcs, were ruined.”




So the Nords were saved, but their leader, Wulfharth, had learned a much more valuable lesson from the combat of the Gods.

Quote:

“As Boy Wulfharth watched the battle in the sky he learned a new thu'um, What Happens When You Shake the Dragon Just So. He used this new magic to change his people back to normal. In his haste to save so many, though, he shook too many years out on himself.”




So what exactly had Wulfharth learned from observing the battle of the Gods in the cosmos? I will attempt to explain with reference to the Yokudan (Redguard) Creation Myths, and with quotes from ‘Varieties of Faith in the Empire’ -

Quote:

“Satakal is much like the Nordic Alduin, who destroys one world to begin the next. In Yokudan mythology, Satakal had done (and still does) this many times over, a cycle which prompted the birth of spirits that could survive the transition.”




Quote:

“Tall Papa, was the first god to figure out how to survive the Hunger of Satakal. Following his lead, the other gods learned the 'Walkabout', or a process by which they can persist beyond one lifetime. Tall Papa set the stars in the sky to show lesser spirits how to do this, too.”




So as we can see, Satakal is the same as Alduin, the world-eater who was summoned to destroy the Nords. Tall Papa was the first to figure out how to avoid being destroyed by Satakal, and he told the secrets to the other gods, including his apprentice Sep (who is the same entity as Shor, and also Lorkhan). So, paying particular attention to the line ‘Shor's own ghost then fought the Time-Eater on the spirit plane, as he did at the beginning of time’ – this seems to me to indicate that Shor performed the walkabout to defeat Alduin and save the Nords. Wulfharth, watching the battle in the sky, and the way in which Shor defeats Alduin, learns his new thu’um, ‘What Happens When You Shake the Dragon Just So’. This thu’um I believe to be a version of the Walkabout, it is not a Dragon Break but a Dragon Shake, it is the manipulation of time not the interruption of it. Using this power he restores the Nords, but in doing so he uses up his mortal body. However, Wulfharth is not truly dead, because he has his new Walkabout thu’um and is free to live outside of time.

Sources:

The Five Songs of King Wulfharth
Varieties of Faith in the Empire
Yokudan Creation Myth from The Monomyth
The UESP: The World of Tamriel


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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: phil_t]
      #1656366 - 07/29/03 11:11 PM

Quote:

This is my attempt to explain how the mortal Wulfharth became the Underking of lore...




That was very interesting, phil_t. The only thing you left out was the connection of Wulfharth to the Underking. You can do that by using The Arcturian Heresy. Be careful, though. We cannot be sure how accurate that document is. I don’t want to believe that Zurin Arctus wasn’t/isn’t the Underking. I know that that isn’t reason enough to say The Arcturian Heresy is wrong, but I cannot ignore everything that we learned from Daggerfall. There are definitely some pieces of that puzzle that are still missing.

Edited by B (07/29/03 11:21 PM)

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mafafu
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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: ]
      #1656698 - 07/30/03 01:54 AM

Yes, very interesting. The Wulfharth and the Arcturian Heresy has interested me for some time now. I wonder if the ancient Telvanni discovered this (or something similar) in order to extend their lifespans. Some of them were alive during the first mentions of Wulfharth. Even though Chimer/Dunmer live longer than Nords, 4000+ years is still quite some time.

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phil_t
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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: mafafu]
      #1657003 - 07/30/03 03:43 AM

Ah, i realise now that it was an error to use the term Underking - an attempt to link Wulfharth to the Underking was not my intention at this point. My research suggests that Wulfharth has appeared as several entities, but this does not necessarily make him the Underking, which as i understand it means something else entirely. It was not my intention to allude to Zurin Arctus and Tiber Septim in this research (that can be saved for another time ) but merely to show how Wulfharth could have learned to persist through time as different entities.

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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: phil_t]
      #1658324 - 07/30/03 12:13 PM

Very nice. I have a feeling that the "walkabout" is the Tower that Vehk spoke of recently, or perhaps an aspect of the Tower. After all it was Lorkhan that first found the tower.

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Nigedo
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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: phil_t]
      #1671441 - 08/03/03 08:24 PM

You make some excellent points here, Phil. There are clearly parallels between the thu'um of Wulfharth and The Walkabout, I would like to take a moment to offer some contextual analysis.

The excerpt that you have quoted from 'Varieties Of Faith..' may be a little misleading; 'The Monomyth' actually provides a far more comprehensive understanding of the Yokudan Creation Myth. Satakal is widely perceived to be a single entity that the Redguard also commonly refer to as 'The Hum'. But the origins of Satakal lie in the separately identifiable entities of Satak and Akel, the 'World Snake' and its 'Hunger'.

In this bipolar relationship, Satak is the existence of everything (and the exclusion of nothing) while Akel is the deep void (the absolute emptiness). It is the effect of Akel (the 'Hunger') upon Satak (the 'World Snake') that causes Satakal, the serpent that madly and repeatedly devours itself. Clearly these are the same entities as Anu and Padhome and the same cycle of near simultaneous creation and destruction caused by Satakal is described in most creation myths.

The Alduin of the Nordic pantheon is the same Tall Papa or Akatosh that in other pantheons showed other 'immortals' the way to survive beyond the destructive part of the Satakal cycle. In most pantheons this is because Akatosh is credited with being the embodiment of (non-linear) Time, and so, by his very existence, he created a nexus of being outside of the cycle of Satakal. He is thus credited as being an aspect of Stasis, that is Order, in oppositon to the destructive aspect of Akel's nature, that is Change.

This mythic cycle is perceived to have taken place in, what I shall call, the Pre-Mundic Era, that is Time before the creation of the Mundus. With the creation of the Mundus, the role of Akatosh has apparently shifted.

Although Akatosh remains Time; Time itself is now captured by the relationships that bind The Wheel together. He is therefore expressed in a linear method, as the moment of The Wheel as it pivots upon its axis (or axle).

I do not mean to be long-winded ( ) but my point is that, in this context, The Walkabout relates specifically to movement outside of the destructive capture of Satakal, while Wulfharth's thu'um relates to a similar counteraction to the capture of mortals by linear Akatosh (Alduin). So although these two transcendant motions bear a close relationship, they are not precisely the same, on first analysis.


However, you have raised some further unusual issues by making the connection between these two methods. Amongst the belief systems of Men and Mer, the Nordic pantheon stands alone in its depiction of Alduin as the 'Time-Eater', and indeed it is the very advent of Wulfharth the Atmoran Nordic chief that lead to a restoration of the original Nordic pantheon in Tamriel. The Cyrodiilic pantheon is a watered down synthesis of early Nordic and Ayleid religious views (ref. 'Shezzar And The Eight Divines') and so the Imperial Akatosh is closely related to the Meri view. However, this Nordic view echoes the Dunmeri positon, which presents Akatosh as the chief of the Aedric jailers of mortals.

It is from this perpective, in apparent direct confrontation of the "Elven Lie that all Men believe" (ref. Kier-Jo, 'The Elven Lie' 03/09/02), that Vivec presents the six walking ways or "paths to heaven by violence" and the thu'um of Wulfharth would seem to be closely related to these. This 'anti-Aedric' perspective is usefully summarised in Sermon 32;

To be made of dirt is to be treated as such by your jailers.

This is the key and the lock of the Daedra. Why do you think they escaped the compromise?


The same view is again reflected in Jobasha's related comments "To transcend the Mundus, one must learn the Daedra's trick of how to be part of the Mundus without also accepting its limits." (ref. Jobasha, "Re: The Psijic Order, the Altmer, and Lorkhan: A Letter from a Forum Scholar" 03/06/02).


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phil_t
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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: Nigedo]
      #1671591 - 08/03/03 10:15 PM

Thanks for the detailed response everyone -

Nazz - It is my feeling also that Wulfharth's ability is tied into the manipulating of the Tower

Nigedo -

Quote:

So although these two transcendant motions bear a close relationship, they are not precisely the same, on first analysis.





I agree, it is not exactly the Walkabout that is being performed - because he calls it his 'new thu'um' then i would guess that it is a very strong form of thu'um magic, one that he learnt by watching a Walkabout type event during the battle of the Gods and adapting it to his own means perhaps??

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Nigedo
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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: phil_t]
      #1674737 - 08/04/03 08:45 PM

Quote:

...it is not a Dragon Break but a Dragon Shake, it is the manipulation of time not the interruption of it.




Actually, after further thought, I think that you have made a particularly insightful point here, even though it appears to undermine your overall theory.

The thu'um of Wulfharth appears to be a direct action upon the Dragon spoke. Although, as you say, it is not a Break, it is nonetheless a direct disruption of the moment of the Wheel, rather than some Endeavour to transcend the confines of the Wheel-as-prison, through achieving the Tower.

So it is not so much of a transcendance, which 'The Walkabout' certainly was, as it is a kind of Reaching or Lunar magic, which may well be more consistent with it having been learned through an observation of the effect of Lorkhan's 'ghost' upon the Dragon.

On the subject of altering lifespan, an interesting parallel is that Phynaster (Hero-god of Summerset) is credited with teaching the Altmer how to extend their lifespans by a hundred years "by using a shorter walking stride". (ref. Varieties Of Faith...)

I interpret 'walking' in the esoteric sense, of course, and perceive this to mean that they learned how to permanently alter their collective synchronicity with the motion of the Wheel. This particular instance does not actually amount to transcendance either, although there are clearly transcendant elements within both this and Wulfharth's thu'um.

On this basis, it is difficult to see how Wulfharth's thu'um gave him the ability to survive beyond one mortal lifetime which, I agree given these parameters, would be an actual example of mortal transcendance akin to the Aedric transcendance depicted in 'The Walkabout'.

There is the possibility that Wulfharth was never mortal to begin with, at least not in any real sense of being mortal.

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Edited by Nigedo (08/04/03 09:44 PM)

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mafafu
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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: Nigedo]
      #1676514 - 08/05/03 01:04 PM

Something interesting that I just read for the first today is:

Quote:

Auri-El led the original Aldmer against the armies of Lorkhan in mythic times, vanquishing that tyrant and establishing the first kingdoms of the Altmer, Altmora and Old Ehlnofey. He then ascended to heaven in full observance of his followers so that they might learn the steps needed to escape the mortal plane.




This seems as if it might be the same as (or similar to) the walkabout that he taught the other gods and he is now showing to other, lesser spirits through the stars (his ascendance into the heavens).

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phil_t
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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: mafafu]
      #1677034 - 08/05/03 04:59 PM

Quote:

Actually, after further thought, I think that you have made a particularly insightful point here, even though it appears to undermine your overall theory.




Ah, i seem to have been following two different theories, and attempting to link them together. Perhaps there are two processes then - the Walkabout as performed by the Gods such as Tall Papa and Auri-El to transcend the Mundus, and this other form of life extension, as performed perhaps by Wulfharth and Phynaster - and possibly based upon the observation of the Gods. I agree that it would be unlikely that merely using thu'um, even one as powerful as Wulfharth's, that one would be able to slip out of time's controlling hand.

However, didnt Phynaster eventually become considered a 'hero-god' and receive worship? If the power of a being to become a God is based on worship, does that mean that the mortal Phynaster truly did transcend the Mundus and become a God??

Further, would he have become like the Aedra? The Daedra?? Or more like the Divine Tribunal???

Quote:

There is the possibility that Wulfharth was never mortal to begin with, at least not in any real sense of being mortal.




Ah yes, well there is always that ......

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phil_t
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Re: Wulfharth goes Walkabout [Re: phil_t]
      #1681015 - 08/06/03 05:04 PM

Sorry for replying to my own post, but i wish to raise issues to be discussed - my questions are thus, and i hope they bring answers ;

1. What did Wulfharth observe whilst watching the battle of the Gods?

2. How did this teach him his thu'um 'How to shake the Dragon just so'?

3. What is the true nature of this thu'um, indeed is it a thu'um at all or something else?

4. If he could use this thu'um to increase the lifespams of the Nords, then why did he not increase them to thousands of years, as Phynaster did for the Altmer?

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